Men Don’t Like to Hear …
Last night. Oooh, this is a refreshing change. I’m standing at the designated rendezvous point, but Mr. Responsible and I aren’t meeting up for another 20 minutes. Go, Stolie! You’re not only on time for the date — girl, you’re early! This is new territory. Hmm … How should I fill these lovely 20 minutes? I start to wonder, “What do people who arrive for dates early do with themselves?” Then my phone rings. I don’t recognize the number. I figure it’s Mr. Responsible calling from work to say that he’s running late.
I answer the call. “Hello?”
“Hey, it’s me.” I know this voice. It’s Boy #2.
I tell him that I have to go because I have dinner plans with Mr. Responsible. He asks me to call him back later tonight if I get in at a decent hour. Goodbyes are said. The date with Mr. Responsible goes great. At the end of the night, I return home at a decent hour. But, I don’t call Boy #2.
Here’s the deal with boys: I think I just want to be alone. The cop is already out of the picture. Boy #2: I won’t call or answer his calls from now on and, when I see him, I’ll act as AWE suggests — cool, calm collected. Mr. Responsible is the tricky one. I like him a lot as a friend, but I’m starting to think think that he might like me as something more. Men hate the word friend. So, in my past, I’ve avoided the “let’s be friends” conversation all together. And, then, once I start dating a new guy, I hit the “friend” with, “hey, you have to meet my new boyfriend …” I know. I know. Not good. So, what’s a kinder, gentler way to tell someone that you only want to be friends?
March 15th, 2006 at 9:16 am
Hello, new visitor here. Found you on the bbbw ring.
I haven’t found a different way to say let’s just be friends. I tend to be very blunt and direct and the guys I hang with know I’m going to give it to them straight and if they can’t handle it, they’re not strong enough for me anyway, which may be why they’re getting the “let’s be friends.” Heehee.
Sorry for the run-on sentence there. :)
March 15th, 2006 at 9:32 am
honestly stolie, i’ve tried *every* other possible way, boys be daft. boys have actually admitted this to me. they need to hear it straight up and they also need to see it followed up accurately.
say it, mean it, show it.
don’t pussy-foot around it, you’ll just extend the awkwardness for you both. TRUST ME.
and i like your game-plan for Boy #2. another sad truth, boys can’t be given everything they ask for immediately, they suddenly won’t want it anymore. make them work for it, so they learn its value. i hate that bloody game but it seems it’s become more of a survival tactic these days.
i read what you mags/bro said about Boy #2 being an Honourable FuckUp – those are the worst kind, only bc they’ll break your damn heart, repeatedly and still manage to make you feel badly for THEM bc they’re too pathetic to sort themselves out. i had that relationship for three years and oh lawd, the tears. at least with an asshole, you can call him on that and be angry … which progresses you to getting the the end of that entanglement.
_
March 15th, 2006 at 12:48 pm
I have lots of girls that are my friends. We will hook up and go out running around. The just friends thing doesn’t bother me at all. If the connection isn’t there, it isn’t there.
March 15th, 2006 at 1:38 pm
Ditto everything Miss Anon said.
One of my best friends is a boy I’ve known from my freshman year of college (so that would make it, umm…8 years this fall, oh god, I am so old!) The reason we are friends now and never hooked up in the entire year we lived in the same dorm was because I was shy and as he tells me on a regular basis, “boys are stupid.” He had no idea i was into him and eight years later we know WAY too much about each other to ever hook up.
If I have learned one thing it’s that he’s right. It doesn’t matter how intellectually bright they are, when it comes to relationships as D says, (in best forrest gump voice) “stupid is as stupid does.” Maybe it’s something to do with emotional intellegence.
One thing’s for sure, when you feel like it’s time to take a break from boys, for petessake LISTEN. I have run myself aground so many times by not listining to that little voice that says “time out” and goin ahead dating some fool that turned out to be just like the fool I just broke up with. Time outs are good, they give you perspective and space to regroup.
(bet you wish I would shut up already and crawl back into lurker-dom, eh?)
Awe, you sound wonderful (maybe it’s cause you’re a Leo and I do love Leos), but I’m afraid you a prince among frogs, my friend. I find that after there’s been any kind of romantic interest (or perceived interest) at ANY point in our interaction, “just friends” is interpreted as the kiss of death.
Boys, can’t live with um, can’t …oh whatever.
March 15th, 2006 at 2:39 pm
yes, be blunt.
Providing “lets be friends” means lets be friends and not, I dont want to see you again or I’ll keep you around as backup. (cause lets face it…women do that)
Not us of course. But “those other” women.
;-)
March 15th, 2006 at 4:54 pm
If you’re trying to go for the whole slightly friendlier way, then just say something like
“you know, I’m really glad to have made such a great friend”
It’s not quite the “let’s be friends” line, but it’s not hey, let’s date either.
Just a thought.
March 15th, 2006 at 5:56 pm
You know some people(guys) have to be told outright. Some men have to be led around by the collar, becuase thier mother led them around. Generally you can spot such a creature from a respective distance. I am all for telling him outright, the courtesy is only going to make things worse. In the long run you may have actually committed yourself to him by not cutting things off immediately.
Or some crap like that….
March 15th, 2006 at 6:39 pm
Dont go for ‘I think of you as my brother’ Heh
I just try and be honest usually;
“I think you’re a great guy but I dont see a relationship thing happening, sorry. But you seem really cool so if you want to hang out and stuff I’d like that. I just dont want to mislead you thats why I’m telling you this”.
March 15th, 2006 at 8:10 pm
Darwin’s on the money, here, dear. Tell it straight AND tell him that you don’t want to lead him on.
March 16th, 2006 at 5:35 am
Question for you: how come you only want to be friends if the date went – and I quote – ‘great’? Has there been no pashing? I once thought the same about a guy – then he kissed me and it was “wow”. Surprising. Pleasantly so.
Just wondering why you’re so quick to write off a great date….
March 16th, 2006 at 9:22 am
Defiant Goddess: Welcome to the blog. (Checked yours out; love it.) So, blunt and direct, huh? I’ll try it. BTW, no prob about the run-on sentence. No grammar police here. :)
miss anon: I’m actually pretty good about matching words with action. Mr. R and I have been out 4 times and I’ve never kissed him. By the way, I’m really taking your words to heart (”boys can’t be given everything they ask for immediately … make them work for it, so they learn its value”) I’m horrible at playing games; I usually show my feelings (but not my vagina) immediately … And you’re right about the honorable fuckups being the worst kind. At one time, I *did* actually feel sorry for him — even though he’s the one that hurt me.
AWE: You’re GREAT!!! :) I need more male friends like you.
Eddie: Yeah, Miss Anon is brilliant, isn’t she? And, I’m with you on the “Time Out”. I really feel like I need it, so I’m going to take it … About lurker-dom, noooo, don’t crawl back. Stay out here! Play with the other boys and girls. They’re friendly. :)
Stacy: You’re funny! :) I know what you mean. Yeah, this guy isn’t the backup kind, I just genuinely feel that he’s a friend.
Mitch: PERFECT! I’m going to use exactly that sentence: “You know, I’m really glad to have made such a great friend.” Love it. Thanks!
ErikWithaK: I agree with what you’ve said and it seems that everyone is on the same page: straight forward, blunt and outright is the way to go.
Darwin: Ooooh, that’s good. I’ll use Mitch’s sentence and I’ll add the part about not wanting to mislead him.
Pegs: Thanks! :) I agree: tell it to him straight and include the misleading him.
lala: Oh, dear. This is the million dollar question. “How come you only want to be friends if the date went – and I quote – ‘great’?” Okay, here’s the deal. Grab a seat. It’s a long one.
Mr. R’s is a good man. He’s friendly, direct and honest. I enjoy our conversations. He’s older than I am, but he’s constantly growing, changing and challenging himself to do new things. Good, right? And when we go on our dates, he calls if he’s running late, he opens doors for me, he offers to pick up the check, he shares personal stories with me, etc. etc. He’s does all of the right things.
My points of concern? Well … check your email.
But, I think you hit the nail on the head with the “no pashing” thing. BTW, I had to look that word “pashing” up in the dictionary because I didn’t know what it meant. I don’t think we use that word here … Freakin’ Canadians and Aussies, you guys are clever with the whole “English language” thing. ;) But, yeah, no pashing. I don’t feel any desire to kiss him and I don’t want to risk trying it out to see if I could be wrong.
March 16th, 2006 at 9:51 am
I don’t do the “friends” thing. I take that conversation as my exit interview and I leave.
March 16th, 2006 at 10:27 am
I appreciate your honesty. :)
At the moment, I only have 2 nonsexual male friendships because guys usually split when they hear the F word: friend.
All of my other guy friends are either exes like Le Canadien or they’re former fuck buddies.
March 16th, 2006 at 2:50 pm
In way of further explanation.
What I want is a relationship with someone. I’ve had situations that started out as dating, and because of some “buddy vibe” that I seem to give off, the friendship discussion comes up. I’m either too nice, too predictible, not unpredictible enough, not dangerous enough, whatever…point is, she’s just not that into me, so she plays the let’s be friends DVD. Whenever I’ve tried that, eventually we meet up somewhere and she spends the entire f*&king time kvelling over her new guy.
I DON’T WANT TO HEAR THAT CRAP!!!
It takes me a little longer than five minutes to get over my feelings for someone. So rather than have to sit through a meal listening to her dinnertheatre about everything I’m supposedly not, it’s easier for me to be SOMEWHERE ELSE.
If she’s going to end it, I’d rather she did just that. Don’t offer me a consolation prize. I have no desire for “Honorable Mention.”
Sorry. I’m just seeing a lot of one-sided commentary here and nobody seems interested in how the guy might be feeling in these matters.
March 16th, 2006 at 4:09 pm
I dont think its one-sided. If I was into a guy and he pulled the ‘just friends’ line I wouldnt be too thrilled. On the other hand if he took some time out to tell me exactly how he honestly feels in a few simple words (I wouldnt want a speech/essay) rather than a cliched line, I can go away with my respect for him intact.
With regard to being friends; I really dont believe in the “you dont want to date me? ok then have a nice life” thing. Meeting people I can get along with and relate to is quite rare, and I dont want to miss out on the possibility of a great friendship by simply terminating all contact if he’s not interested in a relationship. There is more to life than relationships, and I think that if you do meet someone you can connect with and you enjoy each others company and a relationship is out of the question for whatever reason, that is no reason to deny each other the pleasure of each others company.
Just my viewpoint, sorry if its long.
March 16th, 2006 at 4:27 pm
I really mean it when I say I appreciate your honesty. It’s good to hear what it feels like to be on the receiving end of the “Let’s Just Be Friends” talk.
Three thoughts.
First, friendship isn’t necessarily a consolation prize. Sometimes “let’s be friends” really means just that. Like, this guy? Mr. R.? I like him. I do. It’s just that I don’t have feelings for him in, you know, that way. So, I think it would be great if we could stay in each others’ lives and get to know each other as friends. If he decides that isn’t what he wants, then I’ll respect that.
Second, honesty is the best policy. When The Guy I Almost Married and I broke up 4 years ago, he said that I was his best friend. I told my point blank, “Not only do I not need you as I friend right now, I don’t even fucking want you as a friend. We aren’t best friends, we’re exes.” I said a lot of other hurtful things, but you know what? I was angry. I was hurt. And, most importantly, I was being honest. Sometimes it’s impossible to be friends because one party doesn’t really want that. And, if that’s the case, it’s important to say it.
Thirdly … You mention that you might be “too nice”. This might sound odd, but it *is* possible to be “too nice”. Don’t smack people around or be an asshole, but don’t be “too nice” either. And, what’s “too nice”? Fuck if I know. But, it’s always important to like (and to be nice to) *yourself* more than you like (or are nice to) the other person. So, if you’re nicer to them than you are to yourself or if you’re nicer to them than they are to you, then, I guess that’s “too nice”. Andy once wrote a good post about being Hans Solo. I think he’s on to something.
Hmmm … Maybe I’m too nice to the guys that I date? I might write a full post about this soon. I’d do it tomorrow, but tomorrow is St. Paddy’s Day. Maybe next week …
March 16th, 2006 at 4:32 pm
Darwin … you slipped one in on me there. Good comment, by the way!
For the record, I’ve gone both ways on this. When I’ve been on the receiving end of the friends talk. I’ve walked away when I knew that wasn’t what I wanted from the person. And, I’ve also stayed around when I knew that I wanted to keep that person in my life. The Guy The I Almost Married? I don’t really talk to him anymore. Le Canadien, we still talk, email and see each other when he comes in town.
March 16th, 2006 at 5:25 pm
‘Pashing’ is definitely an Aussie term. Didn’t know what it was myself when I first arrived here, but I’ve since tried it out…. Much better than the ’snogging’ term Brits use, but I digress.
Thanks for the email. I get where you’re coming from. Staying ‘friends’ sounds like a smart decision….if it works. Sounds like he may want more, but if you handle well – and with Mitch’s et als good advice – that sounds possible.
Honesty really is the best possible. Good luck and keep us posted!
March 16th, 2006 at 6:53 pm
Thoughts 1, 2, and 3 understood.
I guess I seem to look at it as if I have been spending several hours a week with you in a dating situation, and we have the discussion, well I have other things to do with my time, like finding someone else to date. So a lot of times former dating partners become friends with my voicemail, not me.
As far as too nice I have dated women who felt that the things that Mr. R. does (normal respectful behaviour) are being “too nice.” I consider that opinion to be extreme, and my last Ex in particular was a bit well, nuts.
March 17th, 2006 at 12:46 am
lala: Pashing? Snogging? What are you people doing to our precious language?!?!? :)
Raymond: You’re honest and that’s exactly why I love you, babycakes!! :)